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Assult Weapon Ban

Cmonkey123

Wanderer
Assault Weapon Ban

I read a few news articles and heard a few radio programs today on this assault weapon ban that is suppose to end very soon; House and Senate members are not sure whether or not to vote yea or nay to continue the ban.

This is corrupt politics at its worst. Why would anyone want to vote no and end the ban on these weapons other than if they were getting money? No one needs these weapons, not for hunting, not even for protecting themselves... These weapons are obviously ment for quickly killing mass numbers of people. I can't believe our Sentators and Reps are even giving this a second thought!

Anyways, I just wanted to hear what everyone here thinks about this whole issue.
 

Dipset

Wanderer
What type of guns do they consider assult weapons? I've been to gun shops around my town and have seen a lot of guns for sale that I'd consider assult weapons.
 

psz

Administrator
The president has said he will not consider renewing the ban, and members of the House (mostly Rs) have said they wouldn't even consider a vote on it.


Why in God's name does anyone need an assult weapon? :-<
 
The ban itself is actually a limit on the number of rounds you can have in a single clip. You can go to any gun show and get these semi automatic weapons fairly easily. The ban limits clips to 10 rounds, except for police issue clips which hold 15. Also, anyone with pre-ban clips for their guns have a 15 or more round clip. The reason they hesitate to reinstate the ban is because many people, particularly law enforcement officers don't see what it matters how many shots you have, it still takes the same amount of bullets to kill you.
 

Dragons Keep

Wanderer
accersories

today there are weapons with same capabilities,if not better than the banned weapon and ban only pertained to clip size and certian accersories like the flash supressor. other than that the same gun companies made legal versions right after the ban took effect. besides even with weapons banned they still appeared in the criminals hands. other than using up tax money to enforce this ban nothing has really changed
 

Cmonkey123

Wanderer
TheOutkastDev said:
The ban itself is actually a limit on the number of rounds you can have in a single clip. You can go to any gun show and get these semi automatic weapons fairly easily. The ban limits clips to 10 rounds, except for police issue clips which hold 15. Also, anyone with pre-ban clips for their guns have a 15 or more round clip. The reason they hesitate to reinstate the ban is because many people, particularly law enforcement officers don't see what it matters how many shots you have, it still takes the same amount of bullets to kill you.

Really? I read it was a ban on several military-type assult rifles; I remeber the AK-47 was one of the weapons banned.

Dragons Keep said:
today there are weapons with same capabilities,if not better than the banned weapon

What legal weapons are more deadly than assault rifles? There are none... It was more than just one weapon too.

Dragons Keep said:
and ban only pertained to clip size and certian accersories like the flash supressor. other than that the same gun companies made legal versions right after the ban took effect. besides even with weapons banned they still appeared in the criminals hands. other than using up tax money to enforce this ban nothing has really changed

Why don't you want the ban to be in place? Okay, so the banned weapons appear in some criminals hands, but the ban makes it a hell of a lot more difficult for criminals or the average person to get.

There's really no argument you can make against the ban. And you just know the Senators and Reps--and probally even Bush!--are not keeping the ban in place because they're being influenced in some way by the gun companies.
 

Mifune

Sorceror
Rather than renewing a fundamentally flawed law, what they need to do is write a better law that actually makes it illegal for people not in law enforcement to own a semi-automatic. However, the simple truth is that this is not a good time to push any sort of large-scale legislation, because of partisan politics during the campaign season. You know President Bush wouldn't risk losing the vote of the NRA less than two months before the most important election of his life. The same goes for a large number of Republicans.

BTW, Outkast, thank you for being one of the few who knows the other side of the story.
 

David

Moderate
I agree that the ban as written did not do much in it's own right. And that the reality of American politics is that now is not the time to push for a real ban. I also agree that something has to be done to keep high power / armor piercing weapons out of the hands of most people. However, one of the best arguments against gun control I ever saw was a bumper sticker that read "If you outlaw guns - only outlaws will have guns." There is some real truth to that.
 

Kesia

Wanderer
Personally I don't see what banning them will do. It will only make some people want them more. And I agree with the fact that it takes the same amount of bullets to kill someone, and that is not just because I am an x law enforcement officer....It is because I am a member of the single action shooter society. It is the fact that we need to teach/learn more gun safty. That should be the issue.
 

Cmonkey123

Wanderer
Kesia said:
Personally I don't see what banning them will do. It will only make some people want them more. And I agree with the fact that it takes the same amount of bullets to kill someone, and that is not just because I am an x law enforcement officer....It is because I am a member of the single action shooter society. It is the fact that we need to teach/learn more gun safty. That should be the issue.

A ban will not make any kind of substantial increase in the number people of who want the guns.... The ban, however, will prevent easy access to these deadly weapons.

You don't need them for hunting or protecting your family, so what do you need them for then? These weapons are obviously ment for killing lots of people fast.
 

bean56

Wanderer
I haven't read everything, but just to add my 2 cents. I've heard that if you own say an ak-47 the government doesn't just come and take it, but it is illegal for you to sell it. That much I'm pretty sure of, but I'm sure there are other things like you can't have it anywhere but in your house or something like that..

I think it's quite obvious that it's stupid to have a limit on the clip and not the gun. Personally I've never been hunting yet, but I wouldn't take an ak-47 to hunt.
 

jerricko

Wanderer
The reason they hesitate to reinstate the ban is because many people, particularly law enforcement officers don't see what it matters how many shots you have, it still takes the same amount of bullets to kill you.

Even if you had horrible aim, a bigger clip would mean more rounds go off before they take 5-30 seconds to reload. So I think it does matter.



Btw, don't you guys mean "assault" weapons, not assult? lol
 

Santaria

Wanderer
Simply by the definition of "Assaut Weapon" all weapons would need to be banned under some theories I am reading here. Let us examine the words first shall we?

as·sault [ ə sáwlt ]

noun (plural as·saults)

1. physical or verbal attack: a violent physical or verbal attack


2. law attack or fear of bodily harm: an unlawful threat of bodily violence or harm to somebody else, or an attempt to do such violence or harm


3. law rape: the offense of raping somebody


4. attempt to destroy something: a campaign or series of actions that aims to challenge or destroy something
The proposals are under assault by various special interest groups.



transitive verb (past as·sault·ed, past participle as·sault·ed, present participle as·sault·ing, 3rd person present singular as·saults)


weap·on [ wéppən ]

noun (plural weap·ons)

1. device designed to injure or kill: a device designed to inflict injury or death on an opponent


2. something used to gain advantage: something used as a way of getting an advantage in a situation
A teacher’s best weapon can be humor.


3. zoology animal’s protective part: an animal part, for example, claws, used for defense or attack



transitive verb (past weap·oned, past participle weap·oned, present participle weap·on·ing, 3rd person present singular weap·ons)

arm somebody: to provide somebody with weapons


[Old English wǣpen . Ultimately from prehistoric Germanic.]


weap·oned adjective
weap·on·less adjective

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Now let's talk about the so called need to ban weapons of self defense. First off, the 2nd amendment guarantees us our right in the country to keep and bear arms.

Arms being synonamous with weapons. Even those mislabled 'assault weapons' as clearly by definition, all weapons are used for assault.

Second Amendment

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.



Secondly, US cities with the strictest 'gun ban' style laws also happen to be the ones with the highest violent crime rates. (Washington DC, Los Angeles and New York.) States like Virginia opted to enact laws that more heavily penalized violent offenders who used weapons to include firearms, not penalizing good citizens excersicing their rights. Subsequently, Virginians, enjoy their freedoms and violent offenders are prosecuted and punished severly all the while maintaining a very low violent crime rate.

Next we must consider some serious foreign case studies. England for example has an all out gun ban. 99% of the time local law enforcement does not even carry firearms. England also enjoys the highest violent crime rate in its history as a result of citizens not being able to defend themselves against well armed ne'er-do-gooders. Criminals in England are using banned firearms in numbers never before seen. Australia is another example. Heavy gun bans are in place. Law enforcement however is allowed to pack heat. Penalties in Austrailia are severe for criminal gun offenses. Subsequently, violent crime in Austrailia has peaked but with the use of knives or bludgeoning weapons. (The penalties are less severe for those types of weapons. Oh, the humanity!)

Finally, one must consider that guns are made to kill. Indeed! And I practice with mine weekly. So do my wife and my two daughters of 16 and 9. We stand ready to protect our lifes and property from those that may wish do us harm or relieve us of possessions. With all the whack jobs running loose in society, my girls will be well prepared to handle themselves. So until someone is willing to stand watch on my wall and prevent harm or loss to my family- with absolute guarantee-keep your hands off my legally owned firearms and your well meaning legislation off my constitutionally protected rights!

Please forgive my grammatical and spelling errors. It has been a long week!

Anyone care to go plinking? ;)
 

Cmonkey123

Wanderer
Santaria said:
Simply by the definition of "Assaut Weapon" all weapons would need to be banned under some theories I am reading here. Let us examine the words first shall we?

as·sault [ ə sáwlt ]

noun (plural as·saults)

1. physical or verbal attack: a violent physical or verbal attack


2. law attack or fear of bodily harm: an unlawful threat of bodily violence or harm to somebody else, or an attempt to do such violence or harm


3. law rape: the offense of raping somebody


4. attempt to destroy something: a campaign or series of actions that aims to challenge or destroy something
The proposals are under assault by various special interest groups.



transitive verb (past as·sault·ed, past participle as·sault·ed, present participle as·sault·ing, 3rd person present singular as·saults)


weap·on [ wéppən ]

noun (plural weap·ons)

1. device designed to injure or kill: a device designed to inflict injury or death on an opponent


2. something used to gain advantage: something used as a way of getting an advantage in a situation
A teacher’s best weapon can be humor.


3. zoology animal’s protective part: an animal part, for example, claws, used for defense or attack



transitive verb (past weap·oned, past participle weap·oned, present participle weap·on·ing, 3rd person present singular weap·ons)

arm somebody: to provide somebody with weapons


[Old English wǣpen . Ultimately from prehistoric Germanic.]


weap·oned adjective
weap·on·less adjective

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Assault weapons are certain types of rapid firing rifles that are ment for military use. Just because the definitions of the individual words say otherwise doesn't mean that every weapon is an assaut weapon. All weapons are ment for assaults but that doesn't make all weapons assault weapons.

Santaria said:
Now let's talk about the so called need to ban weapons of self defense. First off, the 2nd amendment guarantees us our right in the country to keep and bear arms.

So the Constitution should let everyone have military assault weapons? No! Some weapons shouldn't be in the hands of the citizens, namely these assault weapons.

Santaria said:
Secondly, US cities with the strictest 'gun ban' style laws also happen to be the ones with the highest violent crime rates. (Washington DC, Los Angeles and New York.) States like Virginia opted to enact laws that more heavily penalized violent offenders who used weapons to include firearms, not penalizing good citizens excersicing their rights. Subsequently, Virginians, enjoy their freedoms and violent offenders are prosecuted and punished severly all the while maintaining a very low violent crime rate.

Maybe the crimes are related to something else. Just because they have those bans in place and the crime rates are high doesn't mean the crime is directly related to the bans.

Santaria said:
Next we must consider some serious foreign case studies. England for example has an all out gun ban. 99% of the time local law enforcement does not even carry firearms. England also enjoys the highest violent crime rate in its history as a result of citizens not being able to defend themselves against well armed ne'er-do-gooders. Criminals in England are using banned firearms in numbers never before seen. Australia is another example. Heavy gun bans are in place. Law enforcement however is allowed to pack heat. Penalties in Austrailia are severe for criminal gun offenses. Subsequently, violent crime in Austrailia has peaked but with the use of knives or bludgeoning weapons. (The penalties are less severe for those types of weapons. Oh, the humanity!)

England and Australia still have an overall very, very low crime rate. So some criminals there are well armed; that's how it goes everywhere, it's inevitable. But just because those few criminals are well armed doesn't mean all the citizens should be well armed.

Santaria said:
Finally, one must consider that guns are made to kill. Indeed! And I practice with mine weekly. So do my wife and my two daughters of 16 and 9. We stand ready to protect our lifes and property from those that may wish do us harm or relieve us of possessions. With all the whack jobs running loose in society, my girls will be well prepared to handle themselves. So until someone is willing to stand watch on my wall and prevent harm or loss to my family- with absolute guarantee-keep your hands off my legally owned firearms and your well meaning legislation off my constitutionally protected rights!

You need assault rifles to protect your family? Are you afraid the Mafia is going to come and attack your family or something? Even in protecting your family, there's no need for an assault weapon! The majority of gun crimes in the U.S. are done with pistols and semi-automatic rifles anyways.

And unless you live in a very, very high crime area you shouldn't need a weapon in your house at all. Statistics say guns in the home kill more family members than they do criminals.
 

sidsid

Sorceror
I think you probably should take the time to read the ban before you go saying what your ideas of "assault weapons" are. Most fully automatic weapons will still be illegal without special registration and license. This ban primarily lifts the 10 round clip back to 15 or in a few cases 30. The weapon you can buy will be the same you can buy now without the mod-job limited clip, althought there are 19 models that will no longer be restricted either. *BTW: All pre 1994 guns are still legal.
Anyways, the majority of states still have bans on these items. California's is pretty tough. We cant even have internal clip weapons. The national ban being lifted would only free up some federal resources and the states can decide if they still want a ban or not.
I loved reading this list of killings that supporters of the bill say are directly related to assault weapons. There are 8 over 5 years. 2 of them werent even affected by the bill, as shotguns and a .22 bolt action rifle were used. I really dont think that many situations would change by the aggressor having 5 or 10 extra shots. Unless he was just going to slowly kill people one shot each until his clip ran out. Which is unlikely.
I hear about stabbings, hit and runs, stranglings, beatings to death, etc. every day. I think 6 times with about 30 people dead total is fairly limited.
 
Cmonkey123 said:
And unless you live in a very, very high crime area you shouldn't need a weapon in your house at all. Statistics say guns in the home kill more family members than they do criminals.

WRONG! You should always have a weapon in your house. Period. Whether you live in a high crime area or not. You never know if/when someone will break into your house. Living in a low crime area does not grant you immunity to break-ins and robbery.
 

Maynza

Formerly DontdroptheSOAD
TheOutkastDev said:
WRONG! You should always have a weapon in your house. Period. Whether you live in a high crime area or not. You never know if/when someone will break into your house. Living in a low crime area does not grant you immunity to break-ins and robbery.
....
You could die right now from spontaneous human combustion doesnt mean you need to always have a pale of water handy :rolleyes:

Outkast you have a very paranoid point of view
 

Sep102

Page
DontdroptheSOAD said:
....
You could die right now from spontaneous human combustion doesnt mean you need to always have a pale of water handy :rolleyes:

Outkast you have a very paranoid point of view

No, Outkast has a very realistic point of view. My house was broken into around 2 years ago and I don't know what would have happened if my father hadn't had his weapon around. I don't really want to know what would have happened. I think there needs to be some legislation in place dealing with assault weapons, of course, but the ban isn't truly needed, if punishments were stronger, that would decrease the amount of crime, not the total banning of the weapons.
 
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