Update, on Subscriptions.

[jmw_stylus]

It would be unethical to cancel the existing subscriptions before their expiration dates, many of those people will feel cheated and won't re-subscribe. Let them remain until they are all expired - you can convert entirely to the $25 lifetime model through natural attrition, and maybe even get more lifetime subscriptions in the long run as the expired subscribers renew under the new model.

Couldn't have said it better. I very much agree.

 

[septor]

It would be unethical to cancel the existing subscriptions before their expiration dates, many of those people will feel cheated and won't re-subscribe. Let them remain until they are all expired - you can convert entirely to the $25 lifetime model through natural attrition, and maybe even get more lifetime subscriptions in the long run as the expired subscribers renew under the new model.

I agree. I'll pay for a lifetime subscription if my current subscription is allowed to run out, the reason I say this is, what if I upgrade to a lifetime subscription now, and then say 2 or 3 years down the road the subscription fees change, and this same thing happens? Then we're all stuck (and I say stuck in the nicest way possible) paying another fee.

edit:
Or how about, all current subscriptions are looked at, and then depending on how much time they still have, a portion of the lifetime fee is removed, so if someone still has a month left, subtract the old cost of a month from the new lifetime fee, that way people are still getting their current subscription (in a sense).

And then of course, still leave options for people that still wis to donate after they've paid their lifetime subscription cost.

 

[cfaust]

Ryan seems to want to take factors in to consideration; however, I think that there are way to many ideas that require too much math and looking at to be efficient.

 

[Brazen]

I would agree with the majority here... (and since it IS a majority already.. seems the best plan is already apparent) Let existing subscriptions expire naturally. Continue with implimenting the sole subscription option being lifetime fropm here on out.

As for the topic of "value of subscribing" Firstly, having been in this community for over 18 months, maybe 2 years now... The "elitist attitude" of some subscribers has put a LOT Of people off of subscribing, myself and others I talk to regularly included. The biggest value of subscribing SHOULD be (and is now) that the actual cost of these forums and the systems required for the continued development of RunUO be supported by those subscription dollars. Those griping and acting elitist towards those who have not subscribed DOES put people off. Making scripts subscriber only DOES put people off (and perhaps treds legal ground with reguards to the whole project). Being made to feel that as a nonsubscriber you are less important or less a "valid" member of this project/community, puts people off. Having a seperate forum area to chat with subscribers, even the requests forum area included, is a "non issue" from all those I have spoken with in the past. Giving subscribers advance (24 hours or so) offerings of updated versions of RunUO caused only a marginal grumbling of the masses with RC0, and seems a valid impitus to subscribe, without demeaning those who (do not, will not, or can not) subscribe. The moral of this little rambling, is that elitist attitudes do deminish those members willing to subscribe or donate, the actual benifits offered mostly do not cause much effect either way, with some leaning towards gently encouraging subscriptions. Honestly, after all the time I have spent here, and with all those whome I speak to regularly and have met breifly along the way, I think most people will feel compelled to subscribe moreso if it is truely a volentary measure with limited benifits.

 

[cfaust]

Ryan's intent on having a subscriber only area wasn't intended to be "Elitist" at least the way I perceive Ryan and his goals. The actual RunUO team hasn't treated the non-subscribers as less important, only some of the subscribers have done so, proof of this was the release of RunUO 1.0.0; it was released to everyone at the same time, when subscribers wanted it at least a few days before everyone else. Overall the RunUO team are a group of great guys that have treated everyone equally, unless of course you want to talk about the folks that come around demanding this that and the other with an attitude that would hairlip the pope.

I am assuming that the subscription packages were not meant to separate the community, but merely to raise some funds to continue development of RunUO. Some folks would not have donated to RunUO without the "added" bonus forums. I donated earlier in the project's life, before there were subscriptions, and finally got enough saved up in PayPal to get a 3 month subscription. I've got a problem with PayPal and having to directly link that account to my bank account that's why I haven't gotten the new lifetime subscription yet. If they decide to yank my subscription to implement a new system I won't be mad, for the simple fact that when it comes to releasing the software RunUO didn't differintiate between subs and non-subs. This place is the home to the greatest development team ever.

 

[Protius73]

I paid for a 6 month subscription. I would be willing to switch over to a lifetime subscription. I think a lifetime subscription for 25 bucks is great considering i paid 18 for a 6 month. Its Only a 7 dollar difference and its not like 25 bucks is a whole lot of money nowadays.

 

[dstarz20]

I just bought a 6 month sub about 3 weeks ago. I'd be more than happy to pitch in 10 more dollars for a lifer, but if it's easier for the books to pitch in 25.00 at a later date, it's fine with me.

 

[ssalter]

Let the current subscriptions expire normally in their various time frames. When a current subscription is due to expire (or expires) they can renew their subscription for $25/lifetime subscription. If subscriptions expire tomorrow, two months from now or 11 months from now it doesn't matter.
They can re-up at the standard $25/yr. No one would have any cause to complain or whine since when they signed up, it was for a specific subscription rate/timeframe.

It's a no brainer.

 

[ainis]

I've my lifetime subscription more or less one year ago; don't remember exactly, but it sould be around 100$. It was my tiny contribution to the runuo team efforts - but, at that time I've noticed that there was only 6 of us. Sigh. I hope that this "rebate" will convince more people to give some spare - I can fully understand that a project like this need real money plus sponsors.

 

[Seven]

I guess I misunderstood his question as I don't understand why its not possible to just let the older ones expire and remove them from the donation list so that noone else can choose those options again...?

 

[mr_wuss]

It would be unethical to cancel the existing subscriptions before their expiration dates, many of those people will feel cheated and won't re-subscribe. Let them remain until they are all expired - you can convert entirely to the $25 lifetime model through natural attrition, and maybe even get more lifetime subscriptions in the long run as the expired subscribers renew under the new model.

agreed

 

[Thraxus]

Letting existing non-lifetime subscriptions expire would seem to be the natural course of action, unless there is some complication with that plan that hasn't been explained. Perhaps Ryan can clarify whether its actually an option or not.

Regardless, it doesn't really affect me since I've been paying monthly rather than splurge on one of the long-term subscriptions. I never had enough money to burn at one time to do anything but monthly payments, and I figured in the long run I'd be giving more to the RunUO project if I didn't take advantage of the discounted prices.

Anyhow, as of a few minutes ago, I am now a happy lifetime subscriber to RunUO. The Dev Team deserves every penny of that fee, so I'm pleased to be able to throw my $25 into the pot.

 

[Ryan]

The problem is there is NO WAY to stop people form purchasing the other subscriptions without removing them, which in turn removes the subscriptions current users have, and lots not forget that these subscriptions are SUPPOSED TO BE A DONATION NOT A SERVICE.

 

[Thraxus]

Well, that explains that. Thanks for the reply Ryan. I do have a suggestion though if you're looking for ideas that will satisfy everyone.

I don't know how restrictive the system is, but what if you were to simply jack up the price of all non-lifetime subscriptions so that nobody in their right mind would click on them? Set it so high that no matter how rich a person clicks on them, the payment couldn't possibly go through successfully. (like $1,000,000, or whatever the maximum PayPal will let you specify)

I only suggest that because I know you were able to lower the price of the lifetime subscriptions, so it stands to reason that you could just as easily raise the price of the other options.

If that can be done, it might save you some headaches from listening to people whining about their "lost" money.

 

[stormwolff]

To Ryan:

Personally I didnt subscribe for the forums, or any of the other goodies, I subscribed for the good of your project as many others have done. I will subscribe again if you drop the subscriptions or if mine simply expires just for the simple fact that you guys are doing a great job.

If you have to drop them then I say go ahead and drop them. Just be mentally prepared for some unhappy people. You got to do what you got to do to get it where you want it. Some will understand this and some wont. I doubt you would lose any users over this. Your services and what you guys do here at runuo is far too valuable for a user to just walk away over a subscription that at this time doesnt really give us users much other than the satisfaction of helping out a pretty decent project.

 

[KillerBeeZ]

Well, that explains that. Thanks for the reply Ryan. I do have a suggestion though if you're looking for ideas that will satisfy everyone.

I don't know how restrictive the system is, but what if you were to simply jack up the price of all non-lifetime subscriptions so that nobody in their right mind would click on them? Set it so high that no matter how rich a person clicks on them, the payment couldn't possibly go through successfully. (like $1,000,000, or whatever the maximum PayPal will let you specify)

I only suggest that because I know you were able to lower the price of the lifetime subscriptions, so it stands to reason that you could just as easily raise the price of the other options.

If that can be done, it might save you some headaches from listening to people whining about their "lost" money.

a very good point, but instead of making it that high, just making them over the lifetime subscriptions would work, making sure to explain why. If they purchase a month for $50 then thats an extra $50 to RunUO... every month

Is there a reason you want to remove the non lifetime subscriptions? cause it seemed to work well.

I feel that RunUO would get more $$$ the way it is now instead of only lifetime subs.

I mainly subscribe using the monthly plan because I never have $100 on me to spend, having the $25 lifetime will inspire me to get one, but then I'll never end up paying more, whereas if I paid monthly like I do now (or did) then in a few years, I'd be giving more money than I would if I had the $25 lifetime

the reason I subscribe is not as "selfless" as others, I do so to have a signature, and to access the subscriber forums. but I'm willing to pay RunUO whereas I wouldn't with any other site, even if I like them.

There are actually a good many scripts in the subscriber section that are completely invaluble, such as the In-Game customizable regions in a box (thats a must have for custom shards) and the item level system rocks too.

in any case, the real value of subscribing is in your signature. With my sig here I get an average of 5 to 10 new players on my shard per week (its a small shard) I actually get about 25 to 30% of my players from my sig here on RunUO, thats the value... the subscriber section is just a bonus.

in any case, there are a lot of great ideas regarding how to deal with current subscriptions, personally I'd go with what Thraxus said... or maybe edit the system to allow you to remove the subscriptions without canceling them.

wouldn't it be possible to not remove the lower subscriptions but not have them show up? this is a php board right? might be as simple as editing a single line... but I'm not sure as I run a different type of board.

 

[Thraxus]

I'm sure its "possible" for them to remove the visible means of selecting the non-lifetime subscriptions, but what you should consider is whether it is worth the time for them to do it, and the risk of screwing up the existing subscriptions if something goes horribly wrong.

Just a simple edit of the descriptions for the other selections to say something like..

DON'T CHOOSE THIS OPTION YOU FOOLS!
***$1,000,000*** ​

.. should be enough to deter any more subscribers to the old plans.

Hmm.. $1,000,000... $1,000,000... $1,000,000.. ahh there we go, $25! That's the ticket.

 

[KillerBeeZ]

I'm sure its "possible" for them to remove the visible means of selecting the non-lifetime subscriptions, but what you should consider is whether it is worth the time for them to do it, and the risk of screwing up the existing subscriptions if something goes horribly wrong.

Just a simple edit of the descriptions for the other selections to say something like..

DON'T CHOOSE THIS OPTION YOU FOOLS!
***$1,000,000*** ​

.. should be enough to deter any more subscribers to the old plans.

Hmm.. $1,000,000... $1,000,000... $1,000,000.. ahh there we go, $25! That's the ticket.

sure, its all up to them of course, but thats why we run test shards, so we can test stuff without the danger of messing up the production shard.

besides there should be no danger of editing what is displayed, I'm not talking about going into the actual code of the subscriptions just the pages thats shown on the site....

the point I was making about having the non life subs being less than something like 1 mill, is that some people will actually pay for the monthly even if its higher but not too high, but yeah thats just exploiting morons lol so it might cause more probs

in any case, I'm with whatever works.

 

[Captain The First]

*shrugs* If you can turn all that gray reputation I have been getting that people ment to be green green you can have the rest of my year subscription and I'll buy the new lifetime one

Have to remember to press the I approve radio button again people (otherwise the reputation given will be gray not green) hehe

you can just pm me if it's worth the extra effort to you

 

[KillerBeeZ]

*shrugs* If you can turn all that gray reputation I have been getting that people ment to be green green you can have the rest of my year subscription and I'll buy the new lifetime one

Have to remember to press the I approve radio button again people (otherwise the reputation given will be gray not green) hehe

you can just pm me if it's worth the extra effort to you

thats funny, I just made a post about that very subject lol

I plan to get the lifer anyway, my montly runs out on the 2nd lol