If you had a rocket-launcher...

[sidsid]

Disagree all you want. One of our customers' customers is Texaco/Shell. Smith Industries flat out told us when Bush went into office that they pretty much KNEW a war in the Middle East would happen, and that the pipeline would be started.

Since the war, they've been placing bids for contracts in Afgahnistan and Iraq for pipeline use... They forcast in the next ten years an increase in revenue in the 175-350% range, if they can win those bids.

Guess what? There's a pipeline in Afgahnistan now. There's already plans to connect it to one in Iraq.

Bush's comment about hydrogen power was fluff, and members of the adminstration have admitted it was added to the state of the union to deflect oil questions about the middle east interest.

Considering I am one who's had to draw oil/water/gas pipelines (submerged and afloat) onto the British Nautical charts for the past few years as part of my job, I think I know quite a bit about where the pipelines are laid, when they were laid, and what company owns the wells/platforms the come from/go to.

But please, disprove that Bush doesn't want oil money, OR that there isn't a pipeline, OR any of the rest.

Why do the locations of piplines matter one bit? There are pipleines all over the place, and sewer liones, and power lines, and railroad tracks and highways and fiber optic cabling and phone line and all sorts of stuff everywhere, and many companies want to keep expandingit, and their profit margin would be FAR superior to some 175% oil profit increase, which is a standard 2 year increase for telman-0 through telman-B. So apparently the phone companies are out to get the copper mines in the flats of Iraq to make more wires.
Considering the information going around on the British Navy attempts on assassinations against several worldwide key political figures, Im suprised your so up on this.

Im sure youre right, and the big bad boogieman is out to conquer earth and add it to his dragon horde of gold, then sit back over the corpses of alien autopsy victims with Lee Harvey Oswald and gloat about invading Cambodia.

 

[Dr.]

Can we just get back to the orginal post instead discussing about the chim that is G. Bush.

*time warps back in time*

I would blow up the person who started this thread as it will start a dam big political discussion that no one will really read

Phantom, no offence but shut up, if you shut up the whole political "discussion will stop" ok? ta!

 

[Cmonkey123]

"Over the years, the United States has sent many of its fine young men and women into great peril to fight for freedom beyond our borders. The only amount of land we have ever asked for in return is enough to bury those that did not return."

Why do we send those fine young men and women to die for freedom in another country? We have enough problems here...

 

[Mortis]

If America is so dam greedy. When we were the only ones to have the Atom Bomb back in the fourties.

We could have took over the whole world.

Enslaved all pidly countries and took what ever we wanted from any one.

But guess what. Americans are just people who came over from Europe, Asia and Africa.

We have relatives in all the foreign countries. So why would we want to enslave and lord over our ancestors.


If I had a rocket launcher. I would do nothing. You did not say If I had a rocket launcher and the rocket(s) to go with it.

The launcher would be useless with out them.

 

[Muppet]

Most of you don't know me that well, but I grew up as a Navy dependent, and right after high school, joined the USAF, which I eventually retired from. I spent almost half my career as a crewmember on B-52's, and a third of that time on alert duty standing by to deliver nuclear weapons if called upon. Most people don't have a real understanding of what a nuclear weapon is capable of, only a vague notion. The reality is far worse tham most minds can comprehend except in a most abstract manner.

Scarier still is the possibility that a terrorist group gets their hands on one and decides to use it. Why? Becuase they live to kill. They can spout all the political shit they want to, but they are simply mad dogs, and as such need to be exterminated. We just make an easy target for their rhetoric. And like it or not Iraq was and it has been proved that they we aiding terrorist.

The US foreign policy was changed after 9/11, in the fact that we where NOT going to sit around and wait for another aggressor to attack us first. We had changed our minds to actively "take care of" threats against america.

It wasn't the US that gassed their own countryman, or tortured and killed olympic athletes because they didn't win the gold.

We didn't invade Kuwait, kill and torture their citizens for fun and profit.

We may not be the designated world police, but by God, someone has to be. Any human with an ounce of moral fiber and worth a shit could not live with what goes on in other parts of the world. Unless the terrorist everywhere are fought and destroyed, the world as we know it will surely end.

It's so damn easy for some of the citizens of this country to wear their blinders and not see the whole truth, unpalatable as it may be and get on their soap boxes and spout off, but I volunteered my life to give them that right, so they can. I don't ask for any special treatment or consideration, nor do I expect it, but I have lost friends who paid the ultimate sacrifice for our country, and I'll be damned if I'll let that sacrifice go slandered unanswered.

Don't like what I've said?? Disagree with it?? That's OK, it's your right, but it's mine to say Tough Shit.

Our political system is far, far from perfect, but by God it's the best on this screwed up planet, and if we have to shed blood, ours or theirs to protect it, and to protect the innocent from the atrocities of mad dogs like Saddam, then so be it. This nation was built on blood, and for now will need more shed to keep from falling, as harsh as that seems.

 

[GTAFREEK]

Well, i don't want to start a political discussion but I don't think there was a legitimate reason to attack two countries without declaring war. And pulling it all off as if it was a "war against terror". I'm not denying what happened on 9/11/01 but as far as I remember, Iraq had nothing to do with this. I'm also not blaming Bush, I'm blaming the whole government of the US.

Well guess what... you did. There was no reason to say this in this thread. If you wanna talk about this shit, make a new thread called "I'm a dumbass who knows nothing about politics"

 

[psz]

I made a boo boo ;->

It's Texaco-Chevron, not Texaco-Shell ;->

 

[Kamron]

YOU ALL FAILED!

AL Qaeda in english means "The Base".

SINCE you guys didn't know what it means, you obviously have no intelligent input into what is "actually" going on

and by the way... stop debating something which none of you have the power or the guts to try and change. Until I see one of your names on the news, shut up? *goes for both sides*

 

[Cmonkey123]

Most of you don't know me that well, but I grew up as a Navy dependent, and right after high school, joined the USAF, which I eventually retired from. I spent almost half my career as a crewmember on B-52's, and a third of that time on alert duty standing by to deliver nuclear weapons if called upon. Most people don't have a real understanding of what a nuclear weapon is capable of, only a vague notion. The reality is far worse tham most minds can comprehend except in a most abstract manner.

Why can the U.S. have nukes and no one else can? Just because we regard someone as a "threat" they can't have nukes? Some countries would regard us as a threat but they don't come raiding into our country and telling us to dispose of all our nukes.

Scarier still is the possibility that a terrorist group gets their hands on one and decides to use it. Why? Becuase they live to kill. They can spout all the political shit they want to, but they are simply mad dogs, and as such need to be exterminated. We just make an easy target for their rhetoric. And like it or not Iraq was and it has been proved that they we aiding terrorist.

You know the U.S. has aided terrorist groups in the past and infact, they even supplied Iraq with the majority of the weapons they have today.

The US foreign policy was changed after 9/11, in the fact that we where NOT going to sit around and wait for another aggressor to attack us first. We had changed our minds to actively "take care of" threats against america.

Why did we attack Iraq? Why didn't we go to South Korea? We had definite proof of their building all kinds of weapons of mass destruction, rasing a huge army out of the blue, and all sorts of other aggressive actions.

It wasn't the US that gassed their own countryman, or tortured and killed olympic athletes because they didn't win the gold.

We didn't invade Kuwait, kill and torture their citizens for fun and profit.

Why act now? These events happend many years ago. Why didn't we deal with this threat when these events occured?

We may not be the designated world police, but by God, someone has to be. Any human with an ounce of moral fiber and worth a shit could not live with what goes on in other parts of the world. Unless the terrorist everywhere are fought and destroyed, the world as we know it will surely end.

How come only a single country can be the "world police"? For some reason, Bush decided he didn't need the help of several countries and just went at it solo. This situation could have been resolved faster and maybe even totally avoided.

It's so damn easy for some of the citizens of this country to wear their blinders and not see the whole truth, unpalatable as it may be and get on their soap boxes and spout off, but I volunteered my life to give them that right, so they can. I don't ask for any special treatment or consideration, nor do I expect it, but I have lost friends who paid the ultimate sacrifice for our country, and I'll be damned if I'll let that sacrifice go slandered unanswered.

Why does everyone who supports the fighting think that everyone else is being unpatriotic and is not honoring the soldiers who died? I am just as patriotic as anyone else and I honor those who have given their lives for this country.

Ask yourself, why did all those young soldiers die? Because one man decided that he should invade some country that he though was a "threat"?

and if we have to shed blood, ours or theirs to protect it, and to protect the innocent from the atrocities of mad dogs like Saddam, then so be it. This nation was built on blood, and for now will need more shed to keep from falling, as harsh as that seems.

There's other ways to resolve things besides fighting.

"An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind."

 

[Phantom]

I made a boo boo ;->

It's Texaco-Chevron, not Texaco-Shell ;->

Actually you were right

Texaco is owed by Shell there is no more Texaco, as my local store(s) are turning into shell.

Got two on the same corner it used to be a Texaco, my cc turned to a shell.

 

[psz]

The actual company name is ChevronTexaco ;->

That's what I meant :->

 

[Phantom]

I have replies to all the points brought up by Cmonkey.

1) Why can the U.S. have nukes and no one else can? Just because we regard someone as a "threat" they can't have nukes? Some countries would regard us as a threat but they don't come raiding into our country and telling us to dispose of all our nukes.

They can as long as they follow the UN rules set forth by well the UN. If american broke those regulations without declosing them, then I would want somebody to show our president that he is wrong.

2) You know the U.S. has aided terrorist groups in the past and infact, they even supplied Iraq with the majority of the weapons they have today.

Ok so we went in to take those weapons back because well they invaded another country and had the history of killing their own people with gas.

3) Why did we attack Iraq? Why didn't we go to South Korea? We had definite proof of their building all kinds of weapons of mass destruction, rasing a huge army out of the blue, and all sorts of other aggressive actions.

Because South Korea at the time and at this present is talking to us and we have no evidence that they are lying to us. Or we are not ready to act on the inoformation we have. If at any given time they do I am sure we would.

4) Why act now? These events happend many years ago. Why didn't we deal with this threat when these events occured?

Well we didn't act, which is the point, and why they in turn attacked us on 9/11 they thought we would well bite back.

5) How come only a single country can be the "world police"? For some reason, Bush decided he didn't need the help of several countries and just went at it solo. This situation could have been resolved faster and maybe even totally avoided.

If you remeber he gave the UN a time period and said either we all handle it or america will. I think thats fair, besides Saddam broke the rules he had weapons that were breaking his regulations, and we have inteligence he we believe was paying to make chemical weapons/ Of course he was a complete dumbass and was getting owed by those people, but the intent is there.

6) Why does everyone who supports the fighting think that everyone else is being unpatriotic and is not honoring the soldiers who died? I am just as patriotic as anyone else and I honor those who have given their lives for this country.

Because the way you share your views you attack our president. You should not do that, you should vote when the time comes. Just the way you say things.

Ask yourself, why did all those young soldiers die? Because one man decided that he should invade some country that he though was a "threat"?

One man?

Saddam was a threat, he was breaking the UN regulations he promised he would follow. He didn't, he had weapons that broke those regulations. We believe he was buying chemical weapons, he wasn't actually going to get them but he might have. he has connections to 9-11 he SUPPORTS or support followers, or pays them, or that millions and millions of dollars he had, I promise you helped 9/11 happen.

We have helped a country become free. We are doing it, show damn respect to the men and women over in Iraq and support the war. The war is THEM, it has been their lifes for the last year.

 

[Phantom]

The actual company name is ChevronTexaco ;->

That's what I meant :->

again

Texaco is no more

 

[psz]

Funny, they seem to disagree ;->

http://www.chevrontexaco.com/

 

[Kamron]

Texaco went out of business on that corner... shell bought the land (and anything else on it) and tried to make something of it.

Shell does NOT own texaco (nor the other way around). Chevron (technically) owns texaco, but they merged officially into one company, hence why texaco seems to not exist anymore.

 

[Phantom]

Texaco went out of business on that corner... shell bought the land (and anything else on it) and tried to make something of it.

Shell does NOT own texaco (nor the other way around). Chevron (technically) owns texaco, but they merged officially into one company, hence why texaco seems to not exist anymore.

No actually no.

The same guy owns both stores.

That is why the store turned into a shell station. because its a shell station, texaco as a seperate company does not exist therefore seperate stores are no longer needed.

BP and Shell are the two big companies I can think of. There use to be three, Teaxaco BP( ammaco ) and Shell

All I can say is what I was told by the people who worked at the station.

Cups
Store itself
CC

All turned to Shell what can I say? :lol"

 

[Phantom]

Q: Who currently owns and uses the Texaco and Havoline family of brands in the United States?
A: ChevronTexaco is the owner of the Texaco family of brands, including Texaco, Havoline, Xpress Lube, Ursa and others.

Currently, ChevronTexaco does not sell motor fuels under the Texaco brand in the U.S., nor does it operate Star Mart convenience stores in the U.S. It has licensed Shell Oil Products US and Motiva Enterprises, LLC to use those brand names in the U.S. for the marketing of gasoline, diesel fuel, synthetic gasoline and diesel fuels and other synthetic fuels for motor vehicles, and automotive products sold through Texaco-branded retail stations, exclusively until June 30, 2004, and then on a nonexclusive basis until June 30, 2006. ChevronTexaco has announced that it will begin selling motor fuels under the Texaco retail brand on July 1, 2004. ChevronTexaco has also licensed Shell Oil Products US and Motiva Enterprises, LLC to use the Texaco brand for the marketing of kerosene and heating oil in the United States, exclusively until June 30, 2004, and then on a non-exclusive basis until June 30, 2006.

ChevronTexaco currently sells and distributes lubricants, motor oils, antifreeze and coolants under the Texaco family of brands in the U.S. As part of the Oct. 9, 2001, merger of Chevron and Texaco, Shell Oil Products US and Motiva Enterprises, LLC also held, until Aug. 13, 2003, a non-exclusive license to use the Texaco and Havoline brands for the marketing of lubricants, coolants and antifreeze in the U.S. ChevronTexaco has the right to use the Texaco and Havoline brands for lubricants, coolants and antifreeze in the U.S. and worldwide during this period and thereafter. ChevronTexaco had also licensed Shell Oil Products US and Motiva Enterprises, LLC to right to use the Texaco brand for the marketing of propane in the U.S. and lubricants to the U.S. inland marine market on a non-exclusive basis until August 13, 2003. All of the foregoing non-exclusive rights once held by Shell Oil Products US and Motiva Enterprises, LLC have now terminated.

Currently, ChevronTexaco sells and distributes aviation fuels under the Texaco family of brands in the U.S. As part of the Oct. 9, 2001, merger of Chevron and Texaco, Avfuel Corp. obtained a non-exclusive license to use the Texaco brand for aviation fuels and related products at certain Fixed Based Operator sites in the U.S. Avfuel Corp.'s licences to use the Texaco brand ends on Oct. 10, 2004. ChevronTexaco has the right to use the Texaco brand for aviation fuels in the U.S. and worldwide during this period and thereafter.

Explain it all

 

[Muppet]

I have replies to all the points brought up by Cmonkey.

Thanks Phantom, I couldnt have said it better myself, I was out of the office all day yesterday and couldnt respond.

 

[frango9000]

im not in to US politics but this came to myu head:
what can you say or what have you heard or whats your opinion of Venezuela and venezuela's Government... im curious about whats beig thought or said internationaly about the country were i actually live jejeje

 

[Ankron]

I guess as far as going to war, I haven't the foggiest as to what was going on in the government. The media pumps out what they think will sell. Most news companies try to present a non-bias nature, but in the end it represents the political feelings of the ones bying the air time and watching the news (at least what the news company thinks they want to see any way.) Governments have to protect sertain agendas and secrets to prevent, mass mania, miss-leading the public, and so on and so forth. Ok, those are some of the factors. Next our public leaders get inundated with mail, media, phone, calls, and you name it they get it. All about what some fool wants in Alabama, michigan, new york or some other place. It's a lot of presure so what ever they put out they do if for many reasons, and you're not always going to get the whole kabob.

Perhapse the party behind the leader has an agenda, or the leader his/her own agenda, or maybe they're trying to satisfy the publics insatiable appetite for information. What ever... point is I don't care as long as we leave it better than we found it I'm ok. To pull out of places like Afganistan and Iraq, would create a vacume of power and in that vacume chaos ensues. I'd like to see you tell those people to "K.M.A." and leave em with a broken country. That's what breeds fundamentalistic morons who feel it is they're right to force they're beliefs through death murder and destruction. So I don't care what ever the reason it is we went in. We voted for bush, put him in office, then went to war. So lets finnish what we started, and leave it a far better place than we found it, because in the end some one is gonna wanna see "Sin Bad's town", buy gas, and sell what not else with out fear of some cheap a.hole take'n all the loot home.

Now that I said my peice, go for it.