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.NET 4.0 Standard - VS 2010 Solution

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Vorspire

Knight
Can we please move on to the latest versions of the .NET Framework?
We all know .NET 4.0 offers an amazing amount of features over 2.0 - so why can't we have it provided under 4.0?

Visual Studio 2010 project/solution standard schema to be included with the SVN, or as an optional download.

If this doesn't happen with RunUO soon, a few of us are going to make it happen.
My systems are going to require 4.0 - Anyone who wants to use them when released will have to upgrade to 4.0
I'm not the only one though, there are a few devs currently working on systems that require 4.0 - everyone that I know has forced their RunUO compile to 4.0
The census states that if the standard RunUO SVN isn't upgraded, it will give rise to another RunUO fork that will.

Please seriously consider it :)

I'm willing to listen to a valid argument as to why RunUO has not been upgraded yet, but I honestly, at this point in time, see no good reason.
 

MarciXs

Sorceror
Because it doesn't use anything from .NET 2 above...
Save strategy that Asayre wrote is exception.
 

Vorspire

Knight
Because it doesn't use anything from .NET 2 above...
Save strategy that Asayre wrote is exception.

Not a valid argument.
You'll find there's a lot more than the save strategy that uses .net 4 in RunUO - There's a different handler for NetStates an Packets for one. - Take a look in the core rather than just assuming by what you've heard or read around the forums ;)

Oh and don't forget about the speed bonus for compiling, I reduced my compile time by at least 50% when using .net 4.

Also one more point, just because RunUO's core doesn't use many .net 4 features, doesn't mean that developers should have to be restricted to .net 2.0 - .net 4 is what I'm building my Systems on right now - so anyone who wants to use the AutoPVP, etc, will need to upgrade. Fortunately I'll be supplying a management application for RunUO that can compile your core and manage packages automatically for you.
 

MarciXs

Sorceror
I know it compiles faster. But I still think this should be optional. I mean take a look at this :
http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/8z6watww.aspx
If you are running anything lower than Windows XP Home Edition all of sudden you wouldn't be able to use RunUO. Therefore, I believe that because RunUO is open source it should be your choice whether to go .NET 4 or not.
I mean, even I use .NET 4. But I believe this should be optional.
 

Pure Insanity

Sorceror
No clue when that page was made. But you must be high if you think that .net 4 isn't supported on WindowsXP.

Do you have a windows xp system? It's an optional update for xp...and it works fine on xp.

It won't be too long before .net 5 is out, and RunUO will fall even more behind. Optional is rather stupid if .net 4 is so widely supported (even mono supports the new features.) When the features we're speaking of that use .net 4 are in fact that much better then their old counter parts. Making it optional like it currently is...doesn't help. Most people I've ran into think compiling the server with .net 4 enables these features, although it doesn't unless you compile with Framework_4.0 or go in and force the features on no matter what.

It also makes it hard for people to make custom systems that need .net 4, as supporting the system and helping people upgrade their server becomes a hell of a job just so they can use your system. Can't even use the new collection types and features without .net 4, which I find a big let down. RunUO isn't focused on staying current, or on the edge or tech. It's focused on cloning OSI crap, sucks big time...but oh well.
 

Vorspire

Knight
If you are running anything lower than Windows XP Home Edition all of sudden you wouldn't be able to use RunUO.

Yeah... THAT's the problem right there, people who refuse to upgrade their technology can remain ignorant for all I care, they're just gonna miss out on the good things in newer technologies :)
 

Pure Insanity

Sorceror
Yeah...crippling UO for people that are dumb enough to still be on ME or 2000 just sounds like a horrible idea. Then again...so does using CodePlex over Google Code. >_>;
 

Pure Insanity

Sorceror
Well even if everyone can't agree on .net 4 being the new standard. I think it would indeed be nice to provide a visual studio solution setup with the svn, and possibly setups for other IDE's. So new comers can check out the svn and quickly jump into it and compiling a core would be so much easier to explain to people that have no idea how to setup a solution to compile a new core. :/
 
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imachamp

Guest
I know it compiles faster. But I still think this should be optional. I mean take a look at this :
http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/8z6watww.aspx
If you are running anything lower than Windows XP Home Edition all of sudden you wouldn't be able to use RunUO. Therefore, I believe that because RunUO is open source it should be your choice whether to go .NET 4 or not.
I mean, even I use .NET 4. But I believe this should be optional.
People run RunUO on systems lower than XP? I highly doubt it, and i completely disagree that this is even a valid argument. That's really like saying we shouldn't upgrade to 64 bit or 32 bit, because 16 bit works perfectly fine.....Technology moves on, we should move with it. RunUO can benefit from lots of 4.0 features (not to mention 3.5)...
 

MarciXs

Sorceror
"Technology moves on" is a valid argument? The 2.0 is the minimum system req RunUo can work on, why would you set it to 4.0 if it can easily work on 2.0? If it had so many 4.0 features it would be running it by now.

P.S
This was the reason for the thread:
".net 4 is what I'm building my Systems on right now - so anyone who wants to use the AutoPVP, etc, will need to upgrade"
 

Vorspire

Knight
"Technology moves on" is a valid argument? The 2.0 is the minimum system req RunUo can work on, why would you set it to 4.0 if it can easily work on 2.0? If it had so many 4.0 features it would be running it by now.

OK, you're really ignorant and you really have no idea who you're talking to, all I can say is imachamp is 10 times more knowledgeable than myself and most other developers around here, so in short, you're just making yourself look stupid with your comments. It makes me laugh really, because I know who you're arguing with and I know that he can bring you down 10 pegs in a heartbeat, since you think you know so much.

P.S
This was the reason for the thread:
".net 4 is what I'm building my Systems on right now - so anyone who wants to use the AutoPVP, etc, will need to upgrade"

Yeah, that IS one reason for this thread, because I'm sick of using outdated software, if you actually knew anything about .NET you'd realise that there are major differences in 4.0 compared to 2.0 which I would like to use and I'm sure everyone else would - I bet you can't name one major change without Google. QQ

I mean, it's really no skin off my back to just keep my systems closed source and never release them here, it's also no problem for me to compile my own core on 4.0 - So seriously, do you really think that my life depends on this community and me releasing my systems? No, it doesn't, it might for you, but not for me.

The REAL reason for this thread is to point out the general fact that RunUO should have followed suit and supported .NET 4.0 as soon as RunUO 2.1 was released.
What's the point in developing .NET 4.0 features for RunUO 2.0 compiled on .NET 2.0 and switching them on and off with a silly definition argument, it's absurd, RunUO is becoming a farce, this thread will never be seen by an active developer on the team and if it does, the request for 4.0 will never be granted, why? - Because no one on the dev team cares, or has the time, they care about the UO Gamers shards and maintaining them.

Look at the evidence:
ConnectUO - Dead, it will NEVER come back.
Any threads related to CUO - Deleted or locked down.
The last update on the announcements forum was 2 months ago.
Ryan only posts updates on the UO Gamers forums.
The forum activity is degenerating to almost nothing and even more so at weekends.
The moderators from the UO Gamers forums have been trolling the dev community forums, removing everything that could be classed as "advertising" - under their own judgement with no guide-lines, borderline Nazis that don't even stick to their own rules, no names shall be mentioned.
They removed a CodePlex link to my systems from my signature under the guise of "advertising" - when there is no advertising involved, my systems require RunUO, it's not a RunUO fork or a project that is intending to destroy RunUO - We may as well delete all the links to the UO SDK while we're there, that's hosted on CodePlex and maintained by a banned member FFS.
What about the fiasco with Ryan, Ravenal and Jeff? - You probably don't know about that though anyone who actually pays attention does.

You have so many opinions that are just being made for the sake of argument, no matter what you say, you still look like a fool, why? Because you're all like: "yeah I compile my server with 4.0 but I still don't agree with you because I'm an ignorant douche"

Seriously, just stop making such dumb posts and RTFM.

PS.
Everything I have said here can be backed by hard evidence, the very fact that a moderator will read this post and most likely delete it or ban me will be enough evidence everyone needs to be sure that they prefer to hide the truth, as if risking myself being banned isn't proof enough.
I have the contacts, I know the history, so there's little point in refuting my reply.
 

MarciXs

Sorceror
I don't know who that dude is, maybe for you comparison of .NET version 2.0 to 4.0 to OS 32bit to 64bit is valid, for me it is not. He might be a genius, I don't know. All I want is RunUO has some minium reqs preserved. You want to go with new features take the source code and do what you want with it.
I dunno, maybe I am looking stupid whatever dude. I don't really care, this is an open thread is it not? You said yourself "I'm willing to listen to a valid argument as to why RunUO has not been upgraded yet"
So that is my argument, to preserve minimum system req as RunUo itself doesn't "need" anything from 2.0 above. Hence, Uogamers set the online record under 2.0.
I know so much? Where have I stated that?
Dude, all I said was that since .NET 4 doesn't work on older Operating Systems, that it would rather stay optional. I mean it works just fine under 2.0 doesn't it? So why the update? It's open source... do what you want with it.

I didn't read the rest as it isn't related to me.
 

m309

Squire
I'm nowhere near the level of programming you guys having this discussion are, but from a casual learner/shard admin/UO enthusiast, I really see no pitfalls or negatives to keeping up with the latest technology. There is literally no valid argument to be made to keep using outdated and eventually unsupported tech. If there WAS a valid argument for any such dispute, then wouldn't RunUO still be 1.0, as it worked perfectly fine from my understanding. Why go to 2.0, 2.1, 2.2 or run an updated SVN version? Arguing the advancement of what we all (I'm assuming here) enjoy as a hobby seems blatantly retarded and a waste of keyboard clicks.
 
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imachamp

Guest
way off-topic but Is razor compiled under .NET 4?
Razor doesnt use 4.0 features... not to mention isnt currently under development. Unfortunately people like you are why projects like this get stale. You say you use 4.0, so why are you so heavy on keeping RunUO on 2.0? You obviously have no investment in 2.0, i dont see why you are fighting it so heavily... is it just for the sake of fighting, or are you really trying to prove something to someone?
 

MarciXs

Sorceror
Razor doesnt use 4.0 features... not to mention isnt currently under development. Unfortunately people like you are why projects like this get stale. You say you use 4.0, so why are you so heavy on keeping RunUO on 2.0? You obviously have no investment in 2.0, i dont see why you are fighting it so heavily... is it just for the sake of fighting, or are you really trying to prove something to someone?
I am not fighting ... see that's the most weird part in it. I had my argument about as to whyt it hasn't been upgraded(what the thread is about, your argument(as to mine)). And all of sudden I have to explain as if I was against it(the idea itself).
I dunno, should I repharse it? My argument as to why RunUo hasn't been upgraded to 4.0 is because quite frankly it can run under 2.0. And 4.0 would need higher system reqs... that's what I think ...
 
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