Paternal Abortion Rights

[WarAngel]

What happens in an abortion clinic
Daily Kos: What happens in an abortion clinic

 

[Kamuflaro]

Randomly noted: I was watching a show, on the discovery channel, about different types of multiple births (twins,identical,non identical,triplets,quads,etc.). It showed development of the various types from the time of fertilization up until the actual birth (kinda interesting actually).

Anyway, they said that on about day 23 ( I think it, don't quote me on that) a cluster of the developing cells spontaneously "convulses" and the immediately surrounding cells follow suit, thus the first heartbeat and then forming into the heart itself.

It got me thinking about this thread and the broader debate of when life begins. I think if you have to pinpoint it to a moment, it would be when the heart (or heart cells, whichever) starts to beat. Especially since we consider life to end when the heart stops beating (and can't be restarted).

This is in no way a reflection of my personal opinions of abortion, one way or the other. Simply food for thought.

human life ends with brain death, you can survive even without a heartbeat.

 

[shrundowr]

Yes cuz its not like people can be braindead also.

 

[o0_Sithid_0o]

This is yet another one of those never ending battles.

You have people for abortion who wont see any part of the other view.
You have people against abortion who wont see any part of the other view.

This shits gonna go on forever. Just let it die already.

 

[o0_Sithid_0o]

Yes cuz its not like people can be braindead also.

Braindead is dead ... idiot. They keep your 'body' alive via machines. That != life.

 

[Radwen]

Simply food

I agree. Abortions lead to yummy meals.

 

[shrundowr]

Braindead is dead ... idiot. They keep your 'body' alive via machines. That != life.

Yes but the only reason braindeth counts as death is because it stops all the organs... namely the heart from working also.

 

[HellRazor]

This is yet another one of those never ending battles.

You have people for abortion who wont see any part of the other view.
You have people against abortion who wont see any part of the other view.

This shits gonna go on forever. Just let it die already.

Just because one doesn't AGREE with another view doesn't mean that they don't see or consider the other view.

By not discussing it, no one can persuade someone else to change their opinion.

These are discussion forums. Hence, why people post here. And discuss.

 

[HellRazor]

Braindead is dead ... idiot.[/life]

They keep your 'body' alive via machines. That != life.

Depends on your definition of life. (Not much of one in either case, granted.)

But there is a difference between being dead and being braindead.

 

[4RK3TYP3]

Braindead = They can no longer think, therefore cease to be "human" if the sense that they can no longer interact, they can no longer think, they can't breath on their own, and they would die without the machine...therefore, the person is no longer alive, their body has basically been turned into a mound of donateable flesh and organs.

Dead = Dead

 

[HellRazor]

Braindead = They can no longer think, therefore cease to be "human" if the sense that they can no longer interact, they can no longer think, they can't breath on their own, and they would die without the machine...therefore, the person is no longer alive, their body has basically been turned into a mound of donateable flesh and organs.

Boldfaced portion is opinion, not fact.

Dead = Dead

This is fact.

You can be braindead and still be alive (hence the reason we have the word "braindead" to describe the situation). If your heart is beating, and you are breathing (with or without help) you are technically alive, even though it's the life of a vegtable. At least in the legal sense of the word, which is why you need a court order to turn off life support in the absence of a "living will".

I don't argue that it's not any type of life anyone would want to have, and that its "life" only in the technical sense of the word. A life void of consciousness is not much of a life.

 

[Kamuflaro]

Boldfaced portion is opinion, not fact.



This is fact.

You can be braindead and still be alive (hence the reason we have the word "braindead" to describe the situation). If your heart is beating, and you are breathing (with or without help) you are technically alive, even though it's the life of a vegtable. At least in the legal sense of the word, which is why you need a court order to turn off life support in the absence of a "living will".

I don't argue that it's not any type of life anyone would want to have, and that its "life" only in the technical sense of the word. A life void of consciousness is not much of a life.

I agree with you, but I wanted to show a different point with my statement about braindeath... Ppl claim human life begins somewhere, but that's not easy, as you see we already get in trouble deciding, where it ends.

 

[HellRazor]

I agree with you, but I wanted to show a different point with my statement about braindeath... Ppl claim human life begins somewhere, but that's not easy, as you see we already get in trouble deciding, where it ends.

I understand, and you're right. It depends on how you define things, and everyone has their own opinions and beliefs as to where life starts and where it ends.

I'll be the first to agree that someone who is braindead is only alive purely in the technical sense of the word. It's not really a "life" of any sort of quality or meaning.

But of course everyone draws the line at a different point. What about Alzheimers patients? I mean, if a person has basically lost his memories, his sense of self, and his ability to function coherently, are they really living, or is it just a matter of the body continuing to function after the personality has died?